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Navy facing fleet shortfall by 2026

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Anthony58	Navy facing fleet shortfall by 2026	Lead	[-]
Posts: 2548 ( 2-Apr-2009 02:18:21) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	Navy facing fleet shortfall by 2026 Wednesday, April 01, 2009 Over a dozen naval support ships are due to be taken out of service by 2026 despite no immediate replacement plan being in place. MoD statistics show that eight Hunt Class mine countermeasure vessels and eight Sandown class vessels are to be retired by 2026. The first ships are set to begin being taken out of service in 2017, a mere eight years from now. MoD officials have refused to comment on a future capability saying that a decision would be made in the years to come. "Our future requirements for maritime mine detection and clearance are under consideration and our capabilities will be developed over the coming years in order to best meet those requirements," minister for defence equipment and support Quentin Davies told MPs in a written answer. Concerns have already arisen over a drop off in naval capabilities since procurement in this area has been notoriously slow over the last decade. The aircraft carriers, Astute Class submarines and Type 45 destroyers when finished and delivered will all have taken over a decade from concept to finished product. While mine countermeasure vessels are smaller and would therefore take less time to build and test, the current forecasts for a replacement in service by the time the bulk of the older ships are taken out of service in 2020 is not optimistic. Davies has already told Parliament that other shipbuilding projects will be delayed or slowed down in order to prioritise the aircraft carrier work. Since the delivery of the second carrier is not expected before 2018, this is the earliest date in which counter measure vessel construction could begin. In addition, the construction of the Future Surface Combatant, which will serve as a replacement for the Type 22 and Type 23 frigates is also expected to begin around 2018. The Navy may be hard pressed to reinforce the mine clearance fleet by 2026. http://www.defencemanagem...m/news_story.asp?id=9083
StevoJH		#1	[-]
Registered Member Posts: 912 ( 2-Apr-2009 04:19:43) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	No reason why 2-4 Frigates and MCM's couldn't be built simulataneously across the yards building CVF starting in around 2015 or 16 ones all the modules have been produced for the second carrier.
hulahoop7		#2	[-]
Posts: 1374 ( 2-Apr-2009 10:24:53) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	Most of VTs and Govans work would surely be done by 2016. The bits will need to be sown together and the finished hulls fitted out at Rosyth. Govan can get on with FSC and VT can start knocking out C3 mine hunters. 1 a year from each.
Bledlow		#3	[-]
Registered Member Posts: 481 ( 2-Apr-2009 11:20:06) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	The RN has recently said, in connection with the C3 schedule, that the replacement of the MCMVs isn't urgent, as the hulls have plenty of life, and the ships lives can easily be extended. I would expect them to be run on, as the frigates are being. I hope that they receive updated equipment.
Anthony58	Defence cuts since 1997 highlighted	#4	[-]
Posts: 2550 ( 2-Apr-2009 20:23:12) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	Defence cuts since 1997 highlighted Thursday, April 02, 2009 New figures out today from the MoD reveal broad declines in manpower and equipment over the last decade. According to the figures provided to Conservative shadow Defence Secretary Dr Liam Fox, the Forces have seen a decrease of 46,090 servicemen and women in the military since 1997. The figures by Dr Fox were crafted specifically to see the impact that the Labour government has had on defence since 1997. The attack submarine fleet has cut by one third from 12 to 8, while the Frigate and Destroyer fleet has dropped from 35 to 23. In 1997 there were three aircraft carriers according to the figures. Now there are two. Armoured vehicles have dropped by 479 while 168 fixed wing aircraft have been cut to 806. Since 1997 the Navy has lost 16.4 per cent of its strength, the RAF has lost 27 per cent and the Army has lost 2.4 per cent. The TA meanwhile has suffered the biggest drop among the active and reserve forces, experiencing a 38 per cent drop in numbers to 35,000 members. Dr Fox told the Telegraph that the figures represented a "decade of neglect" by Labour. "Recruitment and retention are a growing problem across the Armed Forces, exacerbated by repeated breaches of the harmony guidelines set out to ensure that service personnel are able to spend time with their families, and in training," he added. http://www.defencemanagem...m/news_story.asp?id=9094
reiverman		#5	[-]
Posts: 61 ( 3-Apr-2009 00:46:53) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	Anthony58 wrote: Defence cuts since 1997 highlighted Thursday, April 02, 2009 New figures out today from the MoD reveal broad declines in manpower and equipment over the last decade. According to the figures provided to Conservative shadow Defence Secretary Dr Liam Fox, the Forces have seen a decrease of 46,090 servicemen and women in the military since 1997. The figures by Dr Fox were crafted specifically to see the impact that the Labour government has had on defence since 1997. The attack submarine fleet has cut by one third from 12 to 8, while the Frigate and Destroyer fleet has dropped from 35 to 23. In 1997 there were three aircraft carriers according to the figures. Now there are two. Armoured vehicles have dropped by 479 while 168 fixed wing aircraft have been cut to 806. Since 1997 the Navy has lost 16.4 per cent of its strength, the RAF has lost 27 per cent and the Army has lost 2.4 per cent. The TA meanwhile has suffered the biggest drop among the active and reserve forces, experiencing a 38 per cent drop in numbers to 35,000 members. Dr Fox told the Telegraph that the figures represented a "decade of neglect" by Labour. "Recruitment and retention are a growing problem across the Armed Forces, exacerbated by repeated breaches of the harmony guidelines set out to ensure that service personnel are able to spend time with their families, and in training," he added. http://www.defencemanagem...m/news_story.asp?id=9094 The tories making a point through the torygraph ? How weird
WillR06		#6	[-]
Posts: 1443 ( 3-Apr-2009 01:04:51) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	A valid point though. I am of the Tory persuasion, and don't believe that the next Tory government will cut the Royal Navy further, but I do not expect things to improve much when Liam Fox drops the shadow part of his title, if only because the economy is in such a bad way. Whomever is in power another decade of neglect would be a bad thing. Liam Fox has made a valid point, but I really hope he is able to improve matters for the Royal Navy, if he doesn't he shouldn't level this sort of criticism now.
Jimlad1		#7	[-]
Posts: 1584 ( 3-Apr-2009 23:31:47) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	More to the point many of the stats are highly misleading, as they relate to long planned withdrawals, plus losses on combat operations too. The TA was ripe for cutting in 1998, and the 38% cut reflects that.
WillR06		#8	[-]
Posts: 1455 ( 3-Apr-2009 23:57:39) Reply Quote More My Recent Posts Message Me Connection Blocking Invite Ignore User's Posts	Jimlad1 wrote: More to the point many of the stats are highly misleading, as they relate to long planned withdrawals, plus losses on combat operations too. The TA was ripe for cutting in 1998, and the 38% cut reflects that. I'm sure a few of the cuts were justified, but I personally am troubled by reductions in the number of escorts and SSNs not just since 1997 but since about 1992 - some bits of options for change were a good thing but I would rather have taken less of a peace dividend and re-shaped the forces rather than cut them back as far as was the case. If we could have kept 6 upgraded Type 22 Batch 2s, 4 Type 22 Batch 3s, 12 Type 42s/Type 45s and 16 Type 23 I'd be a happier man - 38 escorts is almost my perfect 40 - though I'd probably be looking to exchange my Type 22s for something requiring less people by now. My point earlier was the we cannot endure another "decade of neglect" either from Labour or the Tories, if we lose another 12 escorts over the next 12 years we're at 11 escorts by 2021 - not a pretty picture!

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