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Jul 9 16 7:20 AM
Jul 10 16 2:43 AM
Jul 10 16 4:44 AM
Jul 10 16 11:08 AM
Jul 14 16 9:22 AM
skipper101 wrote:I'm sure there is some space somewhere?
We found the space on the FFG's they are not that big.
Perhaps XVLS mounted on the side somewhere, they have loads of space and weight available.
Jul 16 16 7:39 AM
Jul 16 16 8:54 AM
Jul 16 16 9:15 AM
skipper101 wrote:The LHD's are 27,000 tones an 8 cell VLS is not going to cause major issues, it could also be installed in a small sponson on either side of the hull or super structure, alternatively XVLS could also be used on deck or bulkhead, with ESSM BLK II and RAM BLK II do not require external guidance and there for no additional radar's required.
And IIRC the Juan Carlos class was designed with space and weight reserved for VLS, though I can't find anything to back that up.
But the point is simple these ships are major and very valuable assets that could be carrying over 1000 Australian People and there for is worth a little money and effort to protect.
Jul 16 16 10:44 AM
Jul 16 16 12:01 PM
skipper101 wrote:Australia has barely ever had an Amphibious warfare fleet, Manoora and Kanimbla were a token effort to have an amphibious capability, the RAN has only a few escort ship's and sometime &%^ hits the fan and the escort may not be able to provide full protection. What ever additional equipment required to support ESSM BLK ii & RAM BLK II could be taken from either decomissioned FFG or FFH's both of which will become available in the near future.
Proper LHD operator's is actually a pretty small club, RAM is considered to be a point defence missile system, ESSM would be a bit more than Point Defence but it would be affordable and available and provide additional protection.
Jul 16 16 3:39 PM
Jul 16 16 5:37 PM
RAM Block 2 require external cueing and mid course correction...
...require external cueing and mid course correction to effectively hit a target, particularly if a target is manuevering. Sea Giraffe won't do that, it's only a volume air and surface search radar.
Jul 16 16 6:53 PM
Jul 16 16 7:29 PM
Jul 17 16 2:59 AM
Jul 17 16 6:20 AM
Jul 17 16 7:59 AM
Jul 17 16 9:38 AM
skipper101 wrote:It's a 27,000 ton ship, I'm sure a small frigate radar is not going to impact much. If weight is an issue just reduce the beer ration by a day. Plus their is at least a 3,000 ton growth margin which is almost an entire Anzac Frigate. And at best the only additional radar required would be an CelsiusTech 9LV 453 target illumination radar which quite small and light. or even the STIR from the FFG's.
Jul 17 16 12:52 PM
Jul 18 16 4:41 AM
skipper101 wrote:Which part of the 3,000t ton growth margin do you think can't handle a single small radar mount.
In the RAN the maintainers (ET / WEEO) also operate fire control console with the fire control radar, the additional number of crew would be minimal probably somewhere in the order of 1 PO, 2 LS and 4 AB's at most when would considers just additional sea-riders and the ships capacity to carry 1,600 troops (Overload) and 358 ship's company, additional manpower is not an issue, with 3,000 ton growth margin, weight is not an issue. According to the SAAB website the Ceros 200 weights 750kg (http://saab.com/naval/weapon_systems/weapon-control-systems/ceros-200/).
In addition to that Sea Giraffe is a target indication radar I am not 100% sure but It is my understanding that it can provide target quality tracking for weapons engagement meaning with ESSM BLK II a target illumination radar would not even be required. Someone please correct me if I am wrong.
Also IIRC my main point was to use VLS for RAM BLK II and Nulka which of course means no additional radar required.
This is in total a relatively cheap and easy way to protect our most valuable assets using nothing more than the kit we have sitting in ware houses from decommissioned ships. I would again reiterate that I am not advocating turning the LHD's into Air Warfare Cruiser's or Strike platforms and arming them to the teeth with expensive bells and whistles, but adding relatively basic point defence system to protect extremely valuable assets carrying a lot of very valuable people in dangerous situations.
And the only reason anyone would launch a missile attack is if they thought there was a chance that it might get through an air-defence screen otherwise you wouldn't waste the missile. Which means there is a threat to the LHD from possible leaker missiles, in which case the almost non-existent cost of self-defence upgrades are far cheaper than the damage done by a leaker.
To summarise as space and weight are not at all an issue, the equipment is free and available i.e. cheap, and I believe there is a risk to such valuable ships to justify the effort.
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