Fuel supplies Pearl Harbour 1941

Re: Fuel supplies Pearl Harbour 1941

feeds@yuku.com (Glenn239) — Sun, 22 Jun 2008 01:22:19 GMT

Excerpts from the British official history - The War Against Japan, Vol II, pp 116-123

"Nagumo's orders were to concentrate on the airfields, dockyards and shipping in the harbors."

TWAJ does not indicate that Nagumo had specific orders to target the oil tanks.

"The raiders passed over Ratmalana airfield at about 7,000 feet and then turned and dived on the harbour, bombing and machine-gunning shipping in and outside the...

Re: Fuel supplies Pearl Harbour 1941

feeds@yuku.com (Glenn239) — Wed, 18 Jun 2008 18:56:22 GMT

Yes it is BUT his "Pearl Harbor" book also stipulates why a 3rd. strike wasn't possible

And none of those reasons would have been applicable had Nagumo planned from the beginning to fight an extended battle, rather than running.

Further I wasn't using Wilmott to support...

Re: Fuel supplies Pearl Harbour 1941

feeds@yuku.com (ickysdad) — Mon, 16 Jun 2008 16:46:33 GMT

Glenn239 wrote:

If I'm not wrong his later works support my views and just maybe in his later works he adjusted his thinking because of new info???

His latest I've read is from 2004, with the important excerpt from it posted. Willmott says that (1) for various reasons (none that we were previously unware of)...

Re: Fuel supplies Pearl Harbour 1941

feeds@yuku.com (Glenn239) — Mon, 16 Jun 2008 15:46:20 GMT

If I'm not wrong his later works support my views and just maybe in his later works he adjusted his thinking because of new info???

His latest I've read is from 2004, with the important excerpt from it posted. Willmott says that (1) for various reasons (none that we were previously unware of) Nagumo wasn't in a position to attack the tanks at noon on the 7^th and (2)...

Re: Fuel supplies Pearl Harbour 1941

feeds@yuku.com (robdab) — Mon, 16 Jun 2008 08:26:37 GMT
Would the US public feel safer by being able to see the Fleet close to home? - Yes, at least UNTIL someone notices that there is NO battleline present anymore ...

And sooner or later the surviving crewmen are going to get leave to go home, where they WILL talk about what happened at PH.

Re: Fuel supplies Pearl Harbour 1941

feeds@yuku.com (PMN1) — Sun, 15 Jun 2008 01:24:10 GMT
My guess is that sight/news of the surviving US Pacific Fleet being forced to retreat (less battleships) like a whipped dog, to the US West Coast would have significantly increased the "pucker factor" for the average US citizen of 1941/42. If the US national mood then...

Re: Fuel supplies Pearl Harbour 1941

feeds@yuku.com (robdab) — Sat, 14 Jun 2008 22:14:54 GMT
Genn239, in response to your post #130,

"Blowback" by topical association. - If that truely is the case then you have my regrets. But I do seem to remember you trading some nasty barbs with Ken Estes on several occassions/topics.

Either we look at Willmott's body of work or we don't. -I couldn't agree more except that I DON'T own (nor have I access to) Willmott's...

Re: Fuel supplies Pearl Harbour 1941

feeds@yuku.com (ickysdad) — Sat, 14 Jun 2008 17:52:49 GMT
Glenn,
Cherry Picking Wilmott??? If I'm not wrong his later works support my views and just maybe in his later works he adjusted his thinking because of new info???

Re: Fuel supplies Pearl Harbour 1941

feeds@yuku.com (Glenn239) — Sat, 14 Jun 2008 16:59:44 GMT

That may indeed be true but need I remind you that you were also named in the very same "warning" that I received over on tanknet.

"Blowback" by topical association.

I guess then it comes down to what you consider a "reasonable timeframe" to be exactly, doesn't it?

Yes. But the main...

Re: Fuel supplies Pearl Harbour 1941

feeds@yuku.com (robdab) — Fri, 06 Jul 1934 22:13:38 GMT
Glenn239,

Right, but you do also tend towards confrontation and sarcastic displays that don't add to the discussion. - That may indeed be true but need I remind you that you were also named in the very same "warning" that I received over on tanknet. Isn't there a parable somewhere about sin and casting stones ... ? And YES, that was a sarcastic reply. That is the way that I communicate. At least...

Re: Fuel supplies Pearl Harbour 1941

feeds@yuku.com (Glenn239) — Thu, 12 Jun 2008 15:54:13 GMT

Yeah, people that type in the 3rd person "royal" do tend to annoy me.

Right, but you do also tend towards confrontation and sarcastic displays that don't add to the discussion. If you cross the moderator again over there, he'll probably ban you either for months or forever - and no, it...

Re: Fuel supplies Pearl Harbour 1941

feeds@yuku.com (ickysdad) — Thu, 12 Jun 2008 15:11:11 GMT

PMN1 wrote:
In terms of repairing damage weren't a lot of German oil plants back in operation far quicker than expected, admitedly Germany had access to labour it could push harder but....

That was after being hit sometimes by as many or far more bombers carrying far heavier bombs & bombloads then what Vals & Kates could carry.

Re: Fuel supplies Pearl Harbour 1941

feeds@yuku.com (PMN1) — Thu, 12 Jun 2008 13:55:43 GMT
In terms of repairing damage weren't a lot of German oil plants back in operation far quicker than expected, admitedly Germany had access to labour it could push harder but....

Re: Fuel supplies Pearl Harbour 1941

feeds@yuku.com (RALeonard) — Thu, 12 Jun 2008 13:17:53 GMT
Yup. Just like arguing over whether or not this or that author is authentically reporting how many, if any, fuel tanks were destroyed on Midway in the Japanese strike. All you have to do is read the NAS CO's report and, voila! Reality bites, but it is much better than fantasy.

Re: Fuel supplies Pearl Harbour 1941

feeds@yuku.com (ickysdad) — Thu, 12 Jun 2008 06:30:10 GMT

RALeonard wrote:
Re 115

I was not aware that you own this discussion. Your hypothetical is as all others, butt in chair, little or no regard for realities. So, if you don't like my intruding with reality, tough toenails.

You can also add that a few on here completely throw things like doctrine and everything else like it out the window. it's easy to find fault with a plan with...

Re: Fuel supplies Pearl Harbour 1941

feeds@yuku.com (ickysdad) — Thu, 12 Jun 2008 06:13:29 GMT

Creeping Death1929 wrote:

ickysdad wrote:

However were they ordered to attack the other port facilities? If So it seems that "Bloody Shambles II" does say the damage was easily repairable right?

They did attack the other port facilities, and Bloody...

Re: Fuel supplies Pearl Harbour 1941

feeds@yuku.com (robdab) — Thu, 12 Jun 2008 05:23:04 GMT
Glenn239, in response to your posting # 117,

I've posted it here too so that Robdab can comment (just couldn't resist p.o.'ing the moderator over on tanknet, could you?) - Despite that fact that we oft' disagree, I'll never be able to say that you are not a "class act" after this one ! Yeah, people that type in the 3rd person "royal" do tend to annoy me. It wasn't actually my intent to po him...

Re: Fuel supplies Pearl Harbour 1941

feeds@yuku.com (RALeonard) — Thu, 12 Jun 2008 05:00:34 GMT
Re 115

I was not aware that you own this discussion. Your hypothetical is as all others, butt in chair, little or no regard for realities. So, if you don't like my intruding with reality, tough toenails.

Re: Fuel supplies Pearl Harbour 1941

feeds@yuku.com (Creeping Death1929) — Thu, 12 Jun 2008 04:32:23 GMT

ickysdad wrote:

However were they ordered to attack the other port facilities? If So it seems that "Bloody Shambles II" does say the damage was easily repairable right?

They did attack the other port facilities, and Bloody Shambles notes of the Colombo attack: "Although losses in the air had been heavy for the...

Re: Fuel supplies Pearl Harbour 1941

feeds@yuku.com (ickysdad) — Wed, 11 Jun 2008 22:07:03 GMT
Glenn,

I posted my responses to your above 2 posts over on tanknet.

Fuel supplies Pearl Harbour 1941

feeds@yuku.com (PMN1) — Wed, 23 Apr 2008 11:45:20 GMT
Did someone post an article here a while back on the fuel depot at Pearl Harbour December 1941 showing the layout?